Difference between revisions of "Paiste 505"

Latest revision as of 01:32, 4 November 2024

505

Introduction: 1978
Discontinued: 1986 (German factory offered 505s until 1993!)
Background: The successor to the long-running Stambul series, Paiste 505's were released to the public in 1978 and slotted in under the 2002.
There are definitely oddball sizes and types out there that were produced during the transition from the Stambul B8 line and cymbals with both a Stambul emboss and a 505 hand stamp logo exist (see pictures below).
Early Swiss-made Black Label 505's have a single line hand stamp which was later changed to a double line stamp mirroring the 2002 logo, probably in the latter part of 1978 or early in 1979. German-made Black Label 505's always have a single line hand stamp, also the German factory used a different serial numbering system than the Swiss factory, see "Deciphering German serial numbers".
The transition to the Green Label silk screened logo begins in 1981. There are a substantial amount of Green Label 505's out there with no serial number.
At least some German Green Label 505's made in 1983 have a logo variant with a hollow crescent moon and star (picture on lower right).
The line gains new sizes, types and weights during the Green Label phase before it is discontinued in 1986 (The German factory continued to offer 505's in their catalogs until 1993, most likely leftovers) and replaced in price point by the 1000 series and in sound and quality by the 2000 series.
According to an interview with Toomas Paiste, there were two reasons Paiste changed up the B8 lines in 1986:
1. To introduce the innovations in the 3000 line (new lathing, etc.).
2. To get the quality of the budget series in line with prices (more importantly according to Toomas).
The 505's were "too good" for what Paiste was selling them for: they were 35% cheaper than an equivalent 2002 but required almost the same amount of hand labor to produce.
U.S. availability:

Rogers never listed 505's in their catalogs or distributed them in the U.S. from 1978 to 1980 (no black label 505's were sold in the U.S.)
505's were not available in the U.S until ~1981 when Paiste opened their North American distribution center, by then they had the printed "green stamp" logo along with an expanded selection of models and sizes.

Alloy: CuSn8 (Also known as "2002 Bronze")
Quality: "A truly affordable pro-quality cymbal at the student or semi-pro level. Paiste experience, craftsmanship and understanding of choice materials give these cymbals many professional features".
Production: These cymbals were fully hammered into shape, not stamped, the same production techniques were used as on the top line cymbals.
Applications: All types of music, particularly pop and rock.
Sound: "505 cymbals produce a fully resonant, vibrant sound. They are developed to provide the drummer with a good quality cymbal. All Paiste 505 cymbals give a true professional cymbal sound with clear character definition. The ride cymbals have strong definite stick-rhythm sound. The multi-purpose medium cymbals can be used for loud, forceful crash or gentle ride effects, crash cymbals give compact, cutting accents."
Early 80's "Green label" models and size additions can be seen in green below:

Rides

Heavy - 10" 11" 12" 13" 14" 15" 16" 17" 18" 19" 20" 21" 22" 24" 26"
Heavy Ride - 18" 20" 22"
Ride - 13" 16" 18" 20" 22"

Crashes

Crash - 13" 14" 15" 16" 18" 20" 22"
Heavy Crash - 16" 18" 20"
Medium - 10" 11" 12" 13" 14" 15" 16" 17" 18" 19" 20" 21" 22" 24" 26"
Thin - 10" 11" 12" 13" 14" 15" 16" 17" 18" 19" 20" 21" 22" 24" 26"

Hi-Hats

First appearance of 505's in Paiste's '78 catalog, note sizes are the same as the previous Stambul line.
'78 European price list including marching sizes
1979 European catalog.
1985 catalog listing
Early 80's Expanded lineup
1993 German price list
Swiss stamp and black label logo
'87 German 505 with oddball "Paiste" font
German 505 serial# 194708 = ~1979 production
German serial# 203998: ~1980 production (black label restamped as Green label)
No serial number, Swiss Green label 505
B8 Stambul restamped as Early 505 note: single line logo.
German 505/Stambul 14" thin, serial# 171908 = 1977
German 505/Stambul 13" medium, serial# 170661 = 1977
German 505/Stambul 20" heavy, serial# 170603 = 1977
German 505/Stambul 12" heavy, serial# 175481
13" "ride" possibly a restamped black label marching cymbal
black label 13" size stamp still visible
10" medium, most likely a leftover Stambul

Information from: Paiste catalogs, Todd Little, Dan Garza, Boris Smit

1979 Paiste catalog
1985 Paiste catalog

Return to the Paiste Series Portal
Return to the Paiste Cymbal Type Portal

@@ Line 3: / Line 3: @@
 <div style="float:right">__TOC__</div>
 [[File:505 logo.jpg|thumb|right|250px|505 Logo]]
-[[File:505 black label 1 line china logo '81 German.jpg|thumb|right|250px|Black label German stamp.]]
+[[File:Swiss 505 logo.jpg|thumb|right|250px|Black label Swiss stamp.]]
+[[File:German 505 logo 1.jpg|thumb|right|250px|Black label German stamp.]]
 [[File:505 swiss logo.jpg|thumb|right|250px|505 Swiss Logo]]
 [[File:505 green stamp.jpg|thumb|right|250px|'81 and later German green stamp]]
@@ Line 9: / Line 10: @@
 '''Introduction:''' 1978 <br>
 '''Discontinued:''' 1986 (German factory offered 505s until 1993!)<br>
+'''Background:''' The successor to the long-running Stambul series, Paiste 505's were released to the public in 1978 and slotted in under the 2002.<br>
-'''Background:''' The successor to the long-running Stambul series, Paiste 505s were released to the public in 1978 and slotted in under the 2002.<br>
-It appears production of the line might of begun in the Swiss factory staring as early as 1974.<br>
 There are definitely oddball sizes and types out there that were produced during the transition from the Stambul B8 line and cymbals with both a Stambul emboss and a 505 hand stamp logo exist (see pictures below).<br>
-Early Swiss-made Black Label 505s have a single line hand stamp which was later changed to a double line stamp mirroring the 2002 logo, probably in the latter part of 1978 or early in 1979.<br>
+Early Swiss-made Black Label 505's have a single line hand stamp which was later changed to a double line stamp mirroring the 2002 logo, probably in the latter part of 1978 or early in 1979. German-made Black Label 505's always have a single line hand stamp, also the German factory used a different serial numbering system than the Swiss factory, see [https://www.cymbal.wiki/wiki/Paiste_Serial_Numbers#.2A.2AGerman_serial_numbers.2A.2A '''"Deciphering German serial numbers"'''].<br>
-German-made Black Label 505s seem to always have a single line hand stamp also, the German factory used a different serial numbering system* than the Swiss factory (see German serial number breakdown below).<br>
+The transition to the Green Label silk screened logo begins in 1981. There are a substantial amount of Green Label 505's out there with no serial number.<br>
-The transition to the Green Label silk screened logo begins in 1981. There are a substantial amount of Green Label 505s out there with no serial number.<br>
+At least some German Green Label 505's made in 1983 have a logo variant with a hollow crescent moon and star (picture on lower right).<br>
-At least some German Green Label 505s made in 1983 have a logo variant with a hollow crescent moon and star (picture on the right).<br>
+The line gains new sizes, types and weights during the Green Label phase before it is discontinued in 1986 (The German factory continued to offer 505's in their catalogs until 1993, most likely leftovers) and replaced in price point by the 1000 series and in sound and quality by the 2000 series.<br>
-The line gains new sizes and types (and weight) during the Green Label phase before it is discontinued in 1986 (The German factory continued to offer 505's in their catalogs until 1993) and replaced in price point by the 1000 series and in spirit by the 2000 series. The 505s were one of the best values in the history of cymbals, and fought well-above their weight class (sources state that Paiste was losing money on the 505 line: they were 35% cheaper than an equivalent 2002 but required almost the same amount of labor to produce).<br>
+According to an interview with Toomas Paiste, there were two reasons Paiste changed up the B8 lines in 1986:<br>
-<b>U.S. availability</b>
+. To introduce the innovations in the 3000 line (new lathing, etc.). <br>
-*Rogers never listed 505's in their catalogs or distributed them in the U.S. from 1978 to 1980 (no black labels were sold in the U.S.)<br>
+. To get the quality of the budget series in line with prices (more importantly according to Toomas). <br>
+The 505's were "too good" for what Paiste was selling them for: they were 35% cheaper than an equivalent 2002 but required almost the same amount of hand labor to produce.<br>
+<b>U.S. availability:</b>
+*Rogers never listed 505's in their catalogs or distributed them in the U.S. from 1978 to 1980 (no black label 505's were sold in the U.S.)<br>
 *505's were not available in the U.S until ~1981 when Paiste opened their North American distribution center, by then they had the printed "green stamp" logo along with an expanded selection of models and sizes.<br>
-'''Innovation:''' <br>
 '''Alloy:''' [[Identify_Your_Paistes#B8_.282002.29_Alloy|CuSn8]] (Also known as <b>"2002 Bronze"</b>)<br>
 '''Quality:''' "A truly affordable pro-quality cymbal at the student or semi-pro level. Paiste experience, craftsmanship and understanding of choice materials give these cymbals many professional features".<br>
-'''Production:''' Cast cymbals using more mass production (automated) manufacturing methods with some manual hammering<br>
+'''Production:''' These cymbals were fully hammered into shape, not stamped, the same production techniques were used as on the top line cymbals.<br>
-'''Applications:''' All types of music, particularly pop and rock<br>
+'''Applications:''' All types of music, particularly pop and rock.<br>
-'''Users:'''  <br>
 '''Sound:''' "505 cymbals produce a fully resonant, vibrant sound. They are developed to provide the drummer with a good quality cymbal. All Paiste 505 cymbals give a true professional cymbal sound with clear character definition.
 The ride cymbals have strong definite stick-rhythm sound. The multi-purpose medium cymbals can be used for loud, forceful crash or gentle ride effects, crash cymbals give compact, cutting accents."<br>
+<b>Early 80's "Green label" models and size additions can be seen in <font color="green">green</font> below:</b><br><br>
-<b>Early 80's model and size additions can be seen in <font color="green">green</font> below:</b>
 ==== Rides ====
-* '''[[Paiste Ride|Ride]] - [[Paiste 505 16" Ride|16"]] [[Paiste 505 18" Ride|18"]] [[Paiste 505 20" Ride|20"]] [[Paiste 505 22" Ride|22"]]<br>
+* '''[[Paiste Heavy|Heavy]] - [[Paiste 505 10" Heavy|10"]] [[Paiste 505 11" Heavy|11"]] [[Paiste 505 12" Heavy|12"]] [[Paiste 505 13" Heavy|13"]] [[Paiste 505 14" Heavy|14"]] [[Paiste 505 15" Heavy|15"]] [[Paiste 505 16" Heavy|16"]] [[Paiste 505 17" Heavy|17"]] [[Paiste 505 18" Heavy|18"]] [[Paiste 505 19" Heavy|19"]] [[Paiste 505 20" Heavy|20"]] [[Paiste 505 21" Heavy|21"]] [[Paiste 505 22" Heavy|22"]] [[Paiste 505 24" Heavy|24"]] [[Paiste 505 26" Heavy|26"]]<br>
 * '''[[Paiste Heavy Ride|<font color="green">Heavy Ride</font>]]</font> - [[Paiste 505 18" Heavy Ride|<font color="green">18"</font>]] [[Paiste 505 20" Heavy Ride|<font color="green">20"</font>]] [[Paiste 505 22" Heavy Ride|<font color="green">22"</font>]]<br>
+* '''[[Paiste Ride|Ride]] - [[Paiste 505 13" Ride|13"]] [[Paiste 505 16" Ride|16"]] [[Paiste 505 18" Ride|18"]] [[Paiste 505 20" Ride|20"]] [[Paiste 505 22" Ride|22"]]<br>
 ==== Crashes ====
 * '''[[Paiste Crash|Crash]] - [[Paiste 505 13" Crash|<font color="green">13"</font>]] [[Paiste 505 14" Crash|<font color="green">14"</font>]] [[Paiste 505 15" Crash|<font color="green">15"</font>]] [[Paiste 505 16" Crash|16"]] [[Paiste 505 18" Crash|18"]] [[Paiste 505 20" Crash|20"]] [[Paiste 505 22" Crash|22"]]<br>
-* '''[[Paiste Medium|Medium]] - [[Paiste 505 16" Medium|16"]] [[Paiste 505 18" Medium|18"]] [[Paiste 505 20" Medium|20"]] [[Paiste 505 22" Medium|22"]]<br>
 * '''[[Paiste Heavy Crash|<font color="green">Heavy Crash</font>]] - [[Paiste 505 16" Heavy Crash|<font color="green">16"</font>]] [[Paiste 505 18" Heavy Crash|<font color="green">18"</font>]] [[Paiste 505 20" Heavy Crash|<font color="green">20"</font>]]<br>
+* '''[[Paiste Medium|Medium]] - [[Paiste 505 10" Medium|10"]] [[Paiste 505 11" Medium|11"]] [[Paiste 505 12" Medium|12"]] [[Paiste 505 13" Medium|13"]] [[Paiste 505 14" Medium|14"]] [[Paiste 505 15" Medium|15"]] [[Paiste 505 16" Medium|16"]] [[Paiste 505 17" Medium|17"]] [[Paiste 505 18" Medium|18"]] [[Paiste 505 19" Medium|19"]] [[Paiste 505 20" Medium|20"]] [[Paiste 505 21" Medium|21"]] [[Paiste 505 22" Medium|22"]] [[Paiste 505 24" Medium|24"]] [[Paiste 505 26" Medium|26"]]<br>
+* '''[[Paiste Thin|Thin]] - [[Paiste 505 10" Thin|10"]] [[Paiste 505 11" Thin|11"]] [[Paiste 505 12" Thin|12"]] [[Paiste 505 13" Thin|13"]] [[Paiste 505 14" Thin|14"]] [[Paiste 505 15" Thin|15"]] [[Paiste 505 16" Thin|16"]] [[Paiste 505 17" Thin|17"]] [[Paiste 505 18" Thin|18"]] [[Paiste 505 19" Thin|19"]] [[Paiste 505 20" Thin|20"]] [[Paiste 505 21" Thin|21"]] [[Paiste 505 22" Thin|22"]] [[Paiste 505 24" Thin|24"]] [[Paiste 505 26" Thin|26"]]<br>
 ==== Hi-Hats ====
+* '''[[Paiste Heavy Hi-Hat|<font color="green">Heavy Hi-Hat</font>]] - [[Paiste 505 13" Heavy Hi-Hat|<font color="green">13"</font>]] [[Paiste 505 14" Heavy Hi-Hat|<font color="green">14"</font>]] [[Paiste 505 15" Heavy Hi-Hat|<font color="green">15"</font>]]<br>
+* '''[[Paiste Hi-Hat|Hi-Hat]] - [[Paiste 505 13" Hi-Hat|13"]] [[Paiste 505 14" Hi-Hat|14"]] [[Paiste 505 15" Hi-Hat|15"]] [[Paiste 505 16" Hi-Hat|16"]]<br>
 * '''[[Paiste Medium Hi-Hat|Medium Hi-Hat]] - [[Paiste 505 13" Medium Hi-Hat|13"]] [[Paiste 505 14" Medium Hi-Hat|14"]] [[Paiste 505 15" Medium Hi-Hat|15"]]<br>
-* '''[[Paiste Heavy Hi-Hat|<font color="green">Heavy Hi-Hat</font>]] - [[Paiste 505 13" Heavy Hi-Hat|<font color="green">13"</font>]] [[Paiste 505 14" Heavy Hi-Hat|<font color="green">14"</font>]] [[Paiste 505 15" Heavy Hi-Hat|<font color="green">15"</font>]]<br>
 * '''[[Paiste Sound Edge Hi-Hat|<font color="green">Sound Edge Hi-Hat</font>]] - [[Paiste 505 14" Sound Edge Hi-Hat|<font color="green">14"</font>]] [[Paiste 505 15" Sound Edge Hi-Hat|<font color="green">15"</font>]]<br>
 ==== Chinas ====
@@ Line 51: / Line 48: @@
 ==== Splashes ====
 * '''[[Paiste Splash|<font color="green">Splash</font>]] - [[Paiste 505 8" Splash|<font color="green">8"</font>]] [[Paiste 505 10" Splash|<font color="green">10"</font>]] [[Paiste 505 12" Splash|<font color="green">12"</font>]]<br>
+==== Other ====
-====Europe only (or U.S. special order):====
 * '''[[Paiste Marching|Marching]] - [[Paiste 505 12" Marching|12"]] [[Paiste 505 13" Marching|13"]] [[Paiste 505 14" Marching|14"]] [[Paiste 505 15" Marching|15"]] [[Paiste 505 16" Marching|16"]] [[Paiste 505 18" Marching|18"]] [[Paiste 505 20" Marching|20"]]<br>
+* '''[[Paiste Marching China Type|Marching China Type]] - [[Paiste 505 15" Marching China Type|15"]] [[Paiste 505 16" Marching China Type|16"]] [[Paiste 505 17" Marching China Type|17"]]<br>
-* '''[[Paiste China Type|Marching China Type]] - [[Paiste 505 15" Marching China Type|15"]] [[Paiste 505 16" Marching China Type|16"]] [[Paiste 505 17" Marching China Type|17"]]<br>
+* '''[[Paiste Concert|Concert]] - [[Paiste 505 18" Concert|18"]] [[Paiste 505 20" Concert|20"]]<br><br>
-=== Concert ===
-* '''[[Paiste Concert|Concert]] - [[Paiste 505 18" Concert|18"]] [[Paiste 505 20" Concert|20"]]<br>
-<b>Initial 505 listing in Paiste's European 1978 catalog (same sizes/weights as the Stambul series)</b>
-==== Thin ====
-* '''[[Paiste Thin|Thin]] - [[Paiste Stambul 10" Thin|10"]] [[Paiste Stambul 11" Thin|11"]] [[Paiste Stambul 12" Thin|12"]] [[Paiste Stambul 13" Thin|13"]] [[Paiste Stambul 14" Thin|14"]] [[Paiste Stambul 15" Thin|15"]] [[Paiste Stambul 16" Thin|16"]] [[Paiste Stambul 17" Thin|17"]] [[Paiste Stambul 18" Thin|18"]] [[Paiste Stambul 19" Thin|19"]] [[Paiste Stambul 20" Thin|20"]] [[Paiste Stambul 21" Thin|21"]] [[Paiste Stambul 22" Thin|22"]] [[Paiste Stambul 24" Thin|24"]] [[Paiste Stambul 26" Thin|26"]]<br>
-==== Medium ====
-* '''[[Paiste Medium|Medium]] - [[Paiste Stambul 10" Medium|10"]] [[Paiste Stambul 11" Medium|11"]] [[Paiste Stambul 12" Medium|12"]] [[Paiste Stambul 13" Medium|13"]] [[Paiste Stambul 14" Medium|14"]] [[Paiste Stambul 15" Medium|15"]] [[Paiste Stambul 16" Medium|16"]] [[Paiste Stambul 17" Medium|17"]] [[Paiste Stambul 18" Medium|18"]] [[Paiste Stambul 19" Medium|19"]] [[Paiste Stambul 20" Medium|20"]] [[Paiste Stambul 21" Medium|21"]] [[Paiste Stambul 22" Medium|22"]] [[Paiste Stambul 24" Medium|24"]] [[Paiste Stambul 26" Medium|26"]]<br>
-==== Heavy ====
-* '''[[Paiste Heavy|Heavy]] - [[Paiste Stambul 10" Heavy|10"]] [[Paiste Stambul 11" Heavy|11"]] [[Paiste Stambul 12" Heavy|12"]] [[Paiste Stambul 13" Heavy|13"]] [[Paiste Stambul 14" Heavy|14"]] [[Paiste Stambul 15" Heavy|15"]] [[Paiste Stambul 16" Heavy|16"]] [[Paiste Stambul 17" Heavy|17"]] [[Paiste Stambul 18" Heavy|18"]] [[Paiste Stambul 19" Heavy|19"]] [[Paiste Stambul 20" Heavy|20"]] [[Paiste Stambul 21" Heavy|21"]] [[Paiste Stambul 22" Heavy|22"]] [[Paiste Stambul 24" Heavy|24"]] [[Paiste Stambul 26" Heavy|26"]]<br>
-==== Hi-Hats ====
-* '''[[Paiste Hi-Hat|Hi-Hat]] - [[Paiste Stambul 13" Hi-Hat|13"]] [[Paiste Stambul 14" Hi-Hat|14"]] [[Paiste Stambul 15" Hi-Hat|15"]] [[Paiste Stambul 16" Hi-Hat|16"]]<br>
-(*)German made 505's used a different serial numbering format system compared to the Swiss system: the first digit does not equal the year; <b>they are numbered consecutively</b>.<br>
-The second digit is a good <b>general</b> indicator of the year, here's a breakdown (these dates are not exact):<br>
--1979 serial numbers : 10xxxx-20xxxx (17xxxx serial is from around 1977 or 1978. a lower third digit: 171xxx -174xxx  most likely = 1977 while a higher third digit 175xxx - 179xxx puts you around 1978)
-(another example: #196181 late 70's)<br>
-serial numbers: 20xxxx - 21xxxx<br>
--1986 serial numbers: 22xxxx-3xxxxx (example: #228044 early 80's)<br>
--1990 serial numbers: 3xxxxx-4xxxxx (example: #333994 mid 80's, #418074 late 80’s).<br>
-Confirmed specific dates from the German factory:<br>
-serial# 2612xx produced in November 1983 <br>
-serial# 2984xx produced in October 1984 <br>
-serial# 3244xx produced in August 1985 <br>
-(Right before Paiste went to the printed color logos it looks like production increased and they started going through serial numbers at a faster rate.)<br>
 <gallery>
 File:Paiste 1978 catalog.jpg|First appearance of 505's in Paiste's '78 catalog, note sizes are the same as the previous Stambul line.
@@ Line 96: / Line 61: @@
 File:505 black label stamp.jpg|Swiss stamp and black label logo
 File:505 1987 german.jpg|'87 German 505 with oddball "Paiste" font
-File:German 505 serial.jpg|German 505 serial# 194708: ~1979 production
+File:German 505 serial.jpg|German 505 serial# 194708 = ~1979 production
-File:German 505 203998.jpg|German serial# 203998: ~1980 production (restamped as Green label)
+File:German 505 203998.jpg|German serial# 203998: ~1980 production (black label restamped as Green label)
-File:No serial 505.jpg| No serial number Green label 505
+File:No serial 505.jpg|No serial number, Swiss Green label 505
 File:505 stambul.jpg|B8 Stambul restamped as Early 505 note: single line logo.
-File:Thin 14 inch bl 657g.jpg|505/Stambul 14" thin serial# 171908
+File:Thin 14 inch bl 657g.jpg|German 505/Stambul 14" thin, serial# 171908 = 1977
-File:Medium 13 inch bl 587g.jpg|505/Stambul 13" medium serial# 170661
+File:Medium 13 inch bl 587g.jpg|German 505/Stambul 13" medium, serial# 170661 = 1977
-File:Heavy 20 inch bl 2159g.jpg|505/Stambul 20" heavy serial# 170603
+File:Heavy 20 inch bl 2159g.jpg|German 505/Stambul 20" heavy, serial# 170603 = 1977
-File:12 hvy 505 stambul.jpg|505/Stambul 12" heavy serial# 175481
+File:12 hvy 505 stambul.jpg|German 505/Stambul 12" heavy, serial# 175481
 File:505 13 ride.jpg|13" "ride" possibly a restamped black label marching cymbal
 File:505 13 ride bttm.jpg|black label 13" size stamp still visible
 File:505 10 medium.jpg|10" medium, most likely a leftover Stambul
 </gallery>
 ----
 Information from:''' [[Paiste Advertising|Paiste catalogs]], Todd Little, Dan Garza, Boris Smit<br>

Difference between revisions of "Paiste 505"

Latest revision as of 01:32, 4 November 2024

505

Contents

Rides

Crashes

Hi-Hats

Chinas

Splashes

Other

Navigation menu

Personal tools

Namespaces

Variants

Views

More

Search

Navigation

Manufacturers

Tools