Difference between revisions of "Paiste 505"

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== 505 ==
 
== 505 ==
 +
[[File:505 logo.jpg|thumb|right|250px|505 Logo]]
 
<div style="float:right">__TOC__</div>
 
<div style="float:right">__TOC__</div>
−
[[File:505 logo.jpg|thumb|right|250px|505 Logo]]
 
 
[[File:505 black label 1 line china logo '81 German.jpg|thumb|right|250px|Black label German stamp.]]
 
[[File:505 black label 1 line china logo '81 German.jpg|thumb|right|250px|Black label German stamp.]]
 
[[File:505 swiss logo.jpg|thumb|right|250px|505 Swiss Logo]]
 
[[File:505 swiss logo.jpg|thumb|right|250px|505 Swiss Logo]]
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'''Background:''' The successor to the long-running Stambul series, Paiste 505s were released to the public in 1978 and slotted in under the 2002.<br>   
 
'''Background:''' The successor to the long-running Stambul series, Paiste 505s were released to the public in 1978 and slotted in under the 2002.<br>   
−
It appears production of the line might of begun in the Swiss factory staring as early as 1974.<br>
 
 
There are definitely oddball sizes and types out there that were produced during the transition from the Stambul B8 line and cymbals with both a Stambul emboss and a 505 hand stamp logo exist (see pictures below).<br>  
 
There are definitely oddball sizes and types out there that were produced during the transition from the Stambul B8 line and cymbals with both a Stambul emboss and a 505 hand stamp logo exist (see pictures below).<br>  
−
Early Swiss-made Black Label 505s have a single line hand stamp which was later changed to a double line stamp mirroring the 2002 logo, probably in the latter part of 1978 or early in 1979.<br>
+
Early Swiss-made Black Label 505s have a single line hand stamp which was later changed to a double line stamp mirroring the 2002 logo, probably in the latter part of 1978 or early in 1979. German-made Black Label 505s seem to always have a single line hand stamp, also the German factory used a different serial numbering system* than the Swiss factory, see [https://www.cymbal.wiki/wiki/Paiste_Serial_Numbers#.2A.2AGerman_serial_numbers.2A.2A '''"Deciphering German serial numbers"'''].<br>  
−
German-made Black Label 505s seem to always have a single line hand stamp also, the German factory used a different serial numbering system* than the Swiss factory (see German serial number breakdown below).<br>  
 
 
The transition to the Green Label silk screened logo begins in 1981. There are a substantial amount of Green Label 505s out there with no serial number.<br>  
 
The transition to the Green Label silk screened logo begins in 1981. There are a substantial amount of Green Label 505s out there with no serial number.<br>  
−
At least some German Green Label 505s made in 1983 have a logo variant with a hollow crescent moon and star (picture on the right).<br>
+
At least some German Green Label 505s made in 1983 have a logo variant with a hollow crescent moon and star (picture on lower right).<br>
−
The line gains new sizes and types (and weight) during the Green Label phase before it is discontinued in 1986 (The German factory continued to offer 505's in their catalogs until 1993) and replaced in price point by the 1000 series and in spirit by the 2000 series. The 505s were one of the best values in the history of cymbals, and fought well-above their weight class (sources state that Paiste was losing money on the 505 line: they were 35% cheaper than an equivalent 2002 but required almost the same amount of labor to produce).<br>
+
The line gains new sizes, types and weights during the Green Label phase before it is discontinued in 1986 (The German factory continued to offer 505's in their catalogs until 1993, most likely leftovers) and replaced in price point by the 1000 series and in sound and quality by the 2000 series.<br>
−
<b>U.S. availability</b>
+
The 505s were one of the best values in the history of cymbals, and fought well-above their weight class (sources state that Paiste was losing money on the 505 line: they were 35% cheaper than an equivalent 2002 but required almost the same amount of labor to produce).<br>
−
*Rogers never listed 505's in their catalogs or distributed them in the U.S. from 1978 to 1980 (no black labels were sold in the U.S.)<br>  
+
<b>U.S. availability:</b>
 +
*Rogers never listed 505's in their catalogs or distributed them in the U.S. from 1978 to 1980 (no black label 505's were sold in the U.S.)<br>  
 
*505's were not available in the U.S until ~1981 when Paiste opened their North American distribution center, by then they had the printed "green stamp" logo along with an expanded selection of models and sizes.<br>  
 
*505's were not available in the U.S until ~1981 when Paiste opened their North American distribution center, by then they had the printed "green stamp" logo along with an expanded selection of models and sizes.<br>  
−
'''Innovation:''' <br>
 
 
'''Alloy:''' [[Identify_Your_Paistes#B8_.282002.29_Alloy|CuSn8]] (Also known as <b>"2002 Bronze"</b>)<br>
 
'''Alloy:''' [[Identify_Your_Paistes#B8_.282002.29_Alloy|CuSn8]] (Also known as <b>"2002 Bronze"</b>)<br>
 
'''Quality:''' "A truly affordable pro-quality cymbal at the student or semi-pro level. Paiste experience, craftsmanship and understanding of choice materials give these cymbals many professional features".<br>
 
'''Quality:''' "A truly affordable pro-quality cymbal at the student or semi-pro level. Paiste experience, craftsmanship and understanding of choice materials give these cymbals many professional features".<br>
−
'''Production:''' Cast cymbals using more mass production (automated) manufacturing methods with some manual hammering<br>
+
'''Production:''' Cymbals using more mass production (automated) manufacturing methods with some manual hammering.<br>
−
'''Applications:''' All types of music, particularly pop and rock<br>
+
'''Applications:''' All types of music, particularly pop and rock.<br>
−
'''Users:'''  <br>
 
 
'''Sound:''' "505 cymbals produce a fully resonant, vibrant sound. They are developed to provide the drummer with a good quality cymbal. All Paiste 505 cymbals give a true professional cymbal sound with clear character definition.
 
'''Sound:''' "505 cymbals produce a fully resonant, vibrant sound. They are developed to provide the drummer with a good quality cymbal. All Paiste 505 cymbals give a true professional cymbal sound with clear character definition.
 
The ride cymbals have strong definite stick-rhythm sound. The multi-purpose medium cymbals can be used for loud, forceful crash or gentle ride effects, crash cymbals give compact, cutting accents."<br>
 
The ride cymbals have strong definite stick-rhythm sound. The multi-purpose medium cymbals can be used for loud, forceful crash or gentle ride effects, crash cymbals give compact, cutting accents."<br>
  
−
<b>Early 80's model and size additions can be seen in <font color="green">green</font> below:</b>
+
<b>Early 80's "Green label" models and size additions can be seen in <font color="green">green</font> below:</b>
  
 
==== Rides ====
 
==== Rides ====
Line 59: Line 56:
 
=== Concert ===
 
=== Concert ===
 
* '''[[Paiste Concert|Concert]] - [[Paiste 505 18" Concert|18"]] [[Paiste 505 20" Concert|20"]]<br>
 
* '''[[Paiste Concert|Concert]] - [[Paiste 505 18" Concert|18"]] [[Paiste 505 20" Concert|20"]]<br>
−
 
  
 
<b>Initial 505 listing in Paiste's European 1978 catalog (same sizes/weights as the Stambul series)</b>
 
<b>Initial 505 listing in Paiste's European 1978 catalog (same sizes/weights as the Stambul series)</b>
Line 73: Line 69:
 
* '''[[Paiste Hi-Hat|Hi-Hat]] - [[Paiste Stambul 13" Hi-Hat|13"]] [[Paiste Stambul 14" Hi-Hat|14"]] [[Paiste Stambul 15" Hi-Hat|15"]] [[Paiste Stambul 16" Hi-Hat|16"]]<br>
 
* '''[[Paiste Hi-Hat|Hi-Hat]] - [[Paiste Stambul 13" Hi-Hat|13"]] [[Paiste Stambul 14" Hi-Hat|14"]] [[Paiste Stambul 15" Hi-Hat|15"]] [[Paiste Stambul 16" Hi-Hat|16"]]<br>
  
−
(*)German made 505's used a different serial numbering format system compared to the Swiss system: the first digit does not equal the year; <b>they are numbered consecutively</b>.<br>
 
−
The second digit is a good <b>general</b> indicator of the year, here's a breakdown (these dates are not exact):<br>
 
−
1974-1979 serial numbers : 10xxxx-20xxxx (17xxxx serial is from around 1977 or 1978. a lower third digit: 171xxx -174xxx  most likely = 1977 while a higher third digit 175xxx - 179xxx puts you around 1978)
 
−
(another example: #196181 late 70's)<br>
 
−
1980 serial numbers: 20xxxx - 21xxxx<br>
 
−
1981-1986 serial numbers: 22xxxx-3xxxxx (example: #228044 early 80's)<br>
 
−
1986-1990 serial numbers: 3xxxxx-4xxxxx (example: #333994 mid 80's, #418074 late 80’s).<br>
 
−
 
−
Confirmed specific dates from the German factory:<br>
 
−
serial# 2612xx produced in November 1983 <br>
 
−
serial# 2984xx produced in October 1984 <br>
 
−
serial# 3244xx produced in August 1985 <br>
 
−
(Right before Paiste went to the printed color logos it looks like production increased and they started going through serial numbers at a faster rate.)<br>
 
  
 
<gallery>
 
<gallery>
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File:505 black label stamp.jpg|Swiss stamp and black label logo
 
File:505 black label stamp.jpg|Swiss stamp and black label logo
 
File:505 1987 german.jpg|'87 German 505 with oddball "Paiste" font
 
File:505 1987 german.jpg|'87 German 505 with oddball "Paiste" font
−
File:German 505 serial.jpg|German 505 serial# 194708: ~1979 production
+
File:German 505 serial.jpg|German 505 serial# 194708 = ~1979 production
−
File:German 505 203998.jpg|German serial# 203998: ~1980 production (restamped as Green label)
+
File:German 505 203998.jpg|German serial# 203998: ~1980 production (black label restamped as Green label)
−
File:No serial 505.jpg| No serial number Green label 505
+
File:No serial 505.jpg|No serial number, Swiss Green label 505
 
File:505 stambul.jpg|B8 Stambul restamped as Early 505 note: single line logo.
 
File:505 stambul.jpg|B8 Stambul restamped as Early 505 note: single line logo.
−
File:Thin 14 inch bl 657g.jpg|505/Stambul 14" thin serial# 171908
+
File:Thin 14 inch bl 657g.jpg|German 505/Stambul 14" thin, serial# 171908 = 1977
−
File:Medium 13 inch bl 587g.jpg|505/Stambul 13" medium serial# 170661
+
File:Medium 13 inch bl 587g.jpg|German 505/Stambul 13" medium, serial# 170661 = 1977
−
File:Heavy 20 inch bl 2159g.jpg|505/Stambul 20" heavy serial# 170603
+
File:Heavy 20 inch bl 2159g.jpg|German 505/Stambul 20" heavy, serial# 170603 = 1977
−
File:12 hvy 505 stambul.jpg|505/Stambul 12" heavy serial# 175481
+
File:12 hvy 505 stambul.jpg|German 505/Stambul 12" heavy, serial# 175481
 
File:505 13 ride.jpg|13" "ride" possibly a restamped black label marching cymbal
 
File:505 13 ride.jpg|13" "ride" possibly a restamped black label marching cymbal
 
File:505 13 ride bttm.jpg|black label 13" size stamp still visible
 
File:505 13 ride bttm.jpg|black label 13" size stamp still visible

Revision as of 19:52, 15 October 2021

505

505 Logo
Black label German stamp.
505 Swiss Logo
'81 and later German green stamp
German "hollow crescent"

Introduction: 1978
Discontinued: 1986 (German factory offered 505s until 1993!)

Background: The successor to the long-running Stambul series, Paiste 505s were released to the public in 1978 and slotted in under the 2002.
There are definitely oddball sizes and types out there that were produced during the transition from the Stambul B8 line and cymbals with both a Stambul emboss and a 505 hand stamp logo exist (see pictures below).
Early Swiss-made Black Label 505s have a single line hand stamp which was later changed to a double line stamp mirroring the 2002 logo, probably in the latter part of 1978 or early in 1979. German-made Black Label 505s seem to always have a single line hand stamp, also the German factory used a different serial numbering system* than the Swiss factory, see "Deciphering German serial numbers".
The transition to the Green Label silk screened logo begins in 1981. There are a substantial amount of Green Label 505s out there with no serial number.
At least some German Green Label 505s made in 1983 have a logo variant with a hollow crescent moon and star (picture on lower right).
The line gains new sizes, types and weights during the Green Label phase before it is discontinued in 1986 (The German factory continued to offer 505's in their catalogs until 1993, most likely leftovers) and replaced in price point by the 1000 series and in sound and quality by the 2000 series.
The 505s were one of the best values in the history of cymbals, and fought well-above their weight class (sources state that Paiste was losing money on the 505 line: they were 35% cheaper than an equivalent 2002 but required almost the same amount of labor to produce).
U.S. availability:

  • Rogers never listed 505's in their catalogs or distributed them in the U.S. from 1978 to 1980 (no black label 505's were sold in the U.S.)
  • 505's were not available in the U.S until ~1981 when Paiste opened their North American distribution center, by then they had the printed "green stamp" logo along with an expanded selection of models and sizes.

Alloy: CuSn8 (Also known as "2002 Bronze")
Quality: "A truly affordable pro-quality cymbal at the student or semi-pro level. Paiste experience, craftsmanship and understanding of choice materials give these cymbals many professional features".
Production: Cymbals using more mass production (automated) manufacturing methods with some manual hammering.
Applications: All types of music, particularly pop and rock.
Sound: "505 cymbals produce a fully resonant, vibrant sound. They are developed to provide the drummer with a good quality cymbal. All Paiste 505 cymbals give a true professional cymbal sound with clear character definition. The ride cymbals have strong definite stick-rhythm sound. The multi-purpose medium cymbals can be used for loud, forceful crash or gentle ride effects, crash cymbals give compact, cutting accents."

Early 80's "Green label" models and size additions can be seen in green below:

Rides

Crashes

Hi-Hats

Chinas

Splashes

Europe only (or U.S. special order):

Concert

Initial 505 listing in Paiste's European 1978 catalog (same sizes/weights as the Stambul series)

Thin

Medium

Heavy

Hi-Hats


  • First appearance of 505's in Paiste's '78 catalog, note sizes are the same as the previous Stambul line.

  • '78 European price list including marching sizes

  • 1979 European catalog.

  • 1985 catalog listing

  • Early 80's Expanded lineup

  • 1993 German price list

  • Swiss stamp and black label logo

  • '87 German 505 with oddball "Paiste" font

  • German 505 serial# 194708 = ~1979 production

  • German serial# 203998: ~1980 production (black label restamped as Green label)

  • No serial number, Swiss Green label 505

  • B8 Stambul restamped as Early 505 note: single line logo.

  • German 505/Stambul 14" thin, serial# 171908 = 1977

  • German 505/Stambul 13" medium, serial# 170661 = 1977

  • German 505/Stambul 20" heavy, serial# 170603 = 1977

  • German 505/Stambul 12" heavy, serial# 175481

  • 13" "ride" possibly a restamped black label marching cymbal

  • black label 13" size stamp still visible

  • 10" medium, most likely a leftover Stambul

Information from: Paiste catalogs, Todd Little, Dan Garza, Boris Smit

1979 Paiste catalog
1985 Paiste catalog

Return to the Paiste Series Portal
 Return to the Paiste Cymbal Type Portal

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