Difference between revisions of "Paiste Super Formula 602"
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| − | == | + | == Super Formula 602 == |
<div style="float:right">__TOC__</div> | <div style="float:right">__TOC__</div> | ||
| − | [[File:Super 602 logo 2.jpg|thumb|right| | + | [[File:Super 602 logo 2.jpg|thumb|right|350px|catalog logo]] |
| − | [[File:Super 602 logo.jpg|thumb|right| | + | [[File:Super 602 logo.jpg|thumb|right|350px|catalog logo]] |
| − | + | ||
| − | '''Introduction:''' ~ | + | '''Introduction:''' ~1957-'59<br> |
| − | '''Discontinued:''' ~1962: replaced by | + | '''Discontinued:''' ~1962-'63: replaced by [[Paiste Formula 602#Formula 602|Formula 602]]<br> |
| − | '''Background:''' | + | '''Background:''' <br> |
Robert Paiste had been experimenting with cymbals made of B20 bell bronze starting in 1957 when he first opened the Swiss factory (at that point it was a one room shop!).<br> | Robert Paiste had been experimenting with cymbals made of B20 bell bronze starting in 1957 when he first opened the Swiss factory (at that point it was a one room shop!).<br> | ||
| − | It should be noted that Robert founded the Swiss factory across lake Sempach from where their future B20 alloy supplier "Metallwerke Dornach/Swissmetal" was located (Paiste had not used B20 alloy up to that point, little did he know | + | It should be noted that Robert founded the Swiss factory across lake Sempach from where their future B20 alloy supplier "Metallwerke Dornach/Swissmetal" was located (Paiste had not used B20 alloy up to that point, little did he know Swissmetal were the only foundry and mill that produced B20 bronze in all of Switzerland and possibly all of western Europe!). He initially worked with Swissmetal and developed a process of rolling B20 thin enough for B20 cymbal production, Swissmetal previously had not rolled it to such a thin specification but did have the equipment to do it reliably, Robert literally had to teach the foundry technicians how to roll the blanks to his thin specification without cracking! It is believed that Robert spent a couple of years ('57-'59) refining the production process, sound characteristics and model names and sizes, this means that most likely the "Super 602" didn't reach widespread distribution until about 1959. This (new to Paiste) B20 alloy first came onto the market under the name "SUPER FORMULA 602".<br> |
| − | It is believed that Robert spent a couple of years | + | |
| − | + | *Two of the stamps of this series still look very similar to the [https://www.cymbal.wiki/wiki/Paiste_Stambul STAMBUL series] stamp: The "Stambul style" logo seems to come in two versions: one with Formula 602 label and one without, both saye "Super" below the star and crescent moon (see examples below).<br> | |
| − | The name "Super formula 602" is believed to come from Robert making 60 attempts on the production/rolling process before he was satisfied, the "2" refers to it being made from "B20". It is also speculated that the "Super formula" term comes from the process that Swissmetal used to heat, mix and pour the alloy.<br> | + | |
| + | *There are also two versions of a second style which looks like the Early Formula 602 stamp, one has the word "Super" written to the upper right, the second variation does not have the word "Super", neither have the words "Formula 602" (this is why we call it the "plain stamp").<br> | ||
| + | |||
| + | *The name "Super formula 602" is believed to come from Robert making 60 attempts on the production/rolling process before he was satisfied, the "2" refers to it being made from "B20". It is also speculated that the "Super formula" term comes from the process that Swissmetal used to heat, mix and pour the alloy.<br> | ||
| + | |||
| + | *Most if not all Super formulas came with the smaller 7/16" (11mm) mounting hole, this carried on to the early formula 602's until about 1963\64. | ||
| + | |||
| + | *Early Super formulas had many of the then current Stambul attributes: bulbous "igloo bell", similar lathing and profile. As you progress to the end of production, the bells, lathing and profiles resemble the "new" Formula 602 from that period. | ||
| + | |||
| + | * We do not have concrete proof on the chronological order of the different Super formula stamps, as we are exposed and or own more examples we will be able to make and educated guess as to thier correct order. | ||
| + | |||
Note: There is an entirely separate series called [http://www.cymbal.wiki/wiki/Paiste_Super#Super Super] which is not made from B20 alloy and came later. This has caused a lot of confusion over the years.<br> | Note: There is an entirely separate series called [http://www.cymbal.wiki/wiki/Paiste_Super#Super Super] which is not made from B20 alloy and came later. This has caused a lot of confusion over the years.<br> | ||
| − | '''Innovation:''' First B20 cymbal made by Paiste. [https:// | + | '''Innovation:''' First B20 cymbal made by Paiste. [https://youtu.be/KH2TPkhL0Ik?si=hhsP5FEM-9snUOjk Fritz Steger's explanation of the sourcing and development of Paiste's B20 alloy].<br> |
'''Alloy:''' [[Identify_Your_Paistes#B20_Alloy|B20 Bronze]]<br> | '''Alloy:''' [[Identify_Your_Paistes#B20_Alloy|B20 Bronze]]<br> | ||
'''Quality:''' Professional<br> | '''Quality:''' Professional<br> | ||
| Line 20: | Line 30: | ||
'''Applications:''' All types of modern music from that era.<br> | '''Applications:''' All types of modern music from that era.<br> | ||
'''Users:''' Professional musicians and enthusiastic drummers, refined drummers and sound specialists with precise requirements that need a fully developed character in their cymbal sound <br> | '''Users:''' Professional musicians and enthusiastic drummers, refined drummers and sound specialists with precise requirements that need a fully developed character in their cymbal sound <br> | ||
| − | '''Sound:''' Similar to "modern" 602's: [https://youtu.be/Gb_Gl0xqbJs<b>Super Formula 24" ride</b>]<br> | + | '''Sound:''' Similar to [[Paiste Formula 602#Formula 602|"modern" 602's]]: [https://youtu.be/Gb_Gl0xqbJs<b>Super Formula 24" ride</b>]<br><br> |
| − | + | ==== Rides ==== | |
| − | ==== | + | * '''[[Paiste Thin|Thin]] - 12" 13" 14" 15" 16" 18" 20" 22" 24"<br> |
| − | + | * '''[[Paiste Medium|Medium]] - 12" 13" 14" 15" 16" 18" 20" 22" 24"<br> | |
| − | * '''[[Paiste Thin | + | * '''[[Paiste Thin Ride|Thin Ride]] - 18" 20" 22" 24"<br> |
| − | + | * '''[[Paiste Thin Ride Crash|Thin Ride Crash]] - 18" 20" 22" 24"<br> | |
| − | + | * '''[[Paiste Medium Ride|Medium Ride]] - 18" 20" 22" 24"<br> | |
| − | + | * '''[[Paiste Medium Ride Crash|Medium Ride Crash]] - 18" 20" 22" 24"<br> | |
| − | * '''[[Paiste Thin | + | ==== Hi-Hats ==== |
| − | + | * '''[["Festival set" Hi-Hat]] - No. 1, No. 2, No. 3, No. 4<br> | |
| − | ==== Hi-Hats | + | * '''[[Paiste Medium Hi-Hat|Medium Hi-Hat]] - 13" 14" 15" 16"<br> |
| − | + | * '''[[Paiste Thin Hi-Hat|Thin Hi-Hat]] - 13" 14" 15" 16"<br> | |
| − | '''[[ | + | ==== Other ==== |
| − | '''[[Hi-Hat | + | * '''[[Paiste Band Heavy|Band Heavy]] - 12" 13" 14" 15" 16" 18" 20" 22" 24"<br> |
| − | '''[[ | + | * '''[[Paiste Band Medium|Band Medium]] - 12" 13" 14" 15" 16" 18" 20" 22" 24"<br> |
| − | '''[[ | + | * '''[[Paiste Orchestra Heavy|Orchestra Heavy]] - 12" 13" 14" 15" 16" 18" 20" 22" 24"<br> |
| + | * '''[[Paiste Orchestra Medium|Orchestra Medium]] - 12" 13" 14" 15" 16" 18" 20" 22" 24"<br> | ||
| + | <br> | ||
<gallery> | <gallery> | ||
| − | File: | + | File:57 catalog back cover.jpg|'59-'62 catalog back cover, note "Stambul format" style of logo |
| − | File:Paiste- | + | File:Paiste 57-59 catalog 1.jpg|'59-'62 catalog "Stambul format" type logo |
| − | File:Paiste-SuperF602-gen2-logo.jpg|"Super" | + | File:Paiste 57-59 catalog 2.jpg|'59-'62 catalog, note: Buddy Rich listed as an endorser! |
| − | File:Super 602 | + | File:Paiste Super Stambul Standard ad (Melos 1962).jpg|The super formula is still listed in "Melos" magazine in 1962 |
| + | File:Super formula plain stamp.jpg|"plain stamp" | ||
| + | File:19-2200-plain stamp.jpg|plain stamp with "Switzerland" only stamp | ||
| + | File:Paiste-SuperF602-gen2-logo.jpg|"plain stamp Super" stamp | ||
| + | File:16 super formula.jpg|"Super" only Stambul format | ||
| + | File:602 14 super thin 2.jpg|"Super Formula 602" Stambul format | ||
File:Paiste-602-super-top.jpg|Stambul format "Super Formula 602" cymbal | File:Paiste-602-super-top.jpg|Stambul format "Super Formula 602" cymbal | ||
File:Paiste-SuperF602-gen2-top.jpg|"plain stamp" 15" Cymbal | File:Paiste-SuperF602-gen2-top.jpg|"plain stamp" 15" Cymbal | ||
File:Super 602 blank logo 3.jpg|"plain stamp" 22" cymbal | File:Super 602 blank logo 3.jpg|"plain stamp" 22" cymbal | ||
| − | |||
| − | |||
| − | |||
File:Super formula 15 top.jpg|Stambul format 15" thin | File:Super formula 15 top.jpg|Stambul format 15" thin | ||
File:Super formula 15 bttm.jpg|Bottom pic | File:Super formula 15 bttm.jpg|Bottom pic | ||
| − | |||
File:Paiste-pre602-top.jpg|22" plain stamp | File:Paiste-pre602-top.jpg|22" plain stamp | ||
| + | File:16 super formula 2.jpg|16" "Super" Stambul format stamp, very early production | ||
| + | File:16 super formula 3.jpg|16" "Super" Stambul format stamp | ||
| + | File:PXL 20221112 030512690.jpg|15" plain stamp hi hats | ||
| + | File:PXL 20220911 224237700.jpg|2 Super formula Stambul stamp on the left, plain stamp upper right, preserial formula 602 lower right | ||
| + | File:348389490 617278217036845 8312667369944589305 n.jpg|two "Super" only Stambul format cymbals, notice the difference in bell shape | ||
</gallery> | </gallery> | ||
----------- | ----------- | ||
| − | Information from: '''[[Paiste Advertising|Paiste '57-'59 catalog]], Steve Black, Todd Little, Dan Garza | + | Information from: '''[[Paiste Advertising|Paiste '57-'59 catalog]], Steve Black, Todd Little, Dan Garza, Fritz Steger |
Return to the '''[[Paiste Series|Paiste Series Portal]]<br> | Return to the '''[[Paiste Series|Paiste Series Portal]]<br> | ||
Return to the '''[[Paiste Cymbal Type|Paiste Cymbal Type Portal]] | Return to the '''[[Paiste Cymbal Type|Paiste Cymbal Type Portal]] | ||
Latest revision as of 11:10, 10 May 2024
Super Formula 602
Contents
Introduction: ~1957-'59
Discontinued: ~1962-'63: replaced by Formula 602
Background:
Robert Paiste had been experimenting with cymbals made of B20 bell bronze starting in 1957 when he first opened the Swiss factory (at that point it was a one room shop!).
It should be noted that Robert founded the Swiss factory across lake Sempach from where their future B20 alloy supplier "Metallwerke Dornach/Swissmetal" was located (Paiste had not used B20 alloy up to that point, little did he know Swissmetal were the only foundry and mill that produced B20 bronze in all of Switzerland and possibly all of western Europe!). He initially worked with Swissmetal and developed a process of rolling B20 thin enough for B20 cymbal production, Swissmetal previously had not rolled it to such a thin specification but did have the equipment to do it reliably, Robert literally had to teach the foundry technicians how to roll the blanks to his thin specification without cracking! It is believed that Robert spent a couple of years ('57-'59) refining the production process, sound characteristics and model names and sizes, this means that most likely the "Super 602" didn't reach widespread distribution until about 1959. This (new to Paiste) B20 alloy first came onto the market under the name "SUPER FORMULA 602".
- Two of the stamps of this series still look very similar to the STAMBUL series stamp: The "Stambul style" logo seems to come in two versions: one with Formula 602 label and one without, both saye "Super" below the star and crescent moon (see examples below).
- There are also two versions of a second style which looks like the Early Formula 602 stamp, one has the word "Super" written to the upper right, the second variation does not have the word "Super", neither have the words "Formula 602" (this is why we call it the "plain stamp").
- The name "Super formula 602" is believed to come from Robert making 60 attempts on the production/rolling process before he was satisfied, the "2" refers to it being made from "B20". It is also speculated that the "Super formula" term comes from the process that Swissmetal used to heat, mix and pour the alloy.
- Most if not all Super formulas came with the smaller 7/16" (11mm) mounting hole, this carried on to the early formula 602's until about 1963\64.
- Early Super formulas had many of the then current Stambul attributes: bulbous "igloo bell", similar lathing and profile. As you progress to the end of production, the bells, lathing and profiles resemble the "new" Formula 602 from that period.
- We do not have concrete proof on the chronological order of the different Super formula stamps, as we are exposed and or own more examples we will be able to make and educated guess as to thier correct order.
Note: There is an entirely separate series called Super which is not made from B20 alloy and came later. This has caused a lot of confusion over the years.
Innovation: First B20 cymbal made by Paiste. Fritz Steger's explanation of the sourcing and development of Paiste's B20 alloy.
Alloy: B20 Bronze
Quality: Professional
Production: Machine-Hand hammered and hand lathed bronze.
Applications: All types of modern music from that era.
Users: Professional musicians and enthusiastic drummers, refined drummers and sound specialists with precise requirements that need a fully developed character in their cymbal sound
Sound: Similar to "modern" 602's: Super Formula 24" ride
Rides
- Thin - 12" 13" 14" 15" 16" 18" 20" 22" 24"
- Medium - 12" 13" 14" 15" 16" 18" 20" 22" 24"
- Thin Ride - 18" 20" 22" 24"
- Thin Ride Crash - 18" 20" 22" 24"
- Medium Ride - 18" 20" 22" 24"
- Medium Ride Crash - 18" 20" 22" 24"
Hi-Hats
- "Festival set" Hi-Hat - No. 1, No. 2, No. 3, No. 4
- Medium Hi-Hat - 13" 14" 15" 16"
- Thin Hi-Hat - 13" 14" 15" 16"
Other
- Band Heavy - 12" 13" 14" 15" 16" 18" 20" 22" 24"
- Band Medium - 12" 13" 14" 15" 16" 18" 20" 22" 24"
- Orchestra Heavy - 12" 13" 14" 15" 16" 18" 20" 22" 24"
- Orchestra Medium - 12" 13" 14" 15" 16" 18" 20" 22" 24"
'59-'62 catalog back cover, note "Stambul format" style of logo
'59-'62 catalog "Stambul format" type logo
'59-'62 catalog, note: Buddy Rich listed as an endorser!
The super formula is still listed in "Melos" magazine in 1962
"plain stamp"
plain stamp with "Switzerland" only stamp
"plain stamp Super" stamp
"Super" only Stambul format
"Super Formula 602" Stambul format
Stambul format "Super Formula 602" cymbal
"plain stamp" 15" Cymbal
"plain stamp" 22" cymbal
Stambul format 15" thin
Bottom pic
22" plain stamp
16" "Super" Stambul format stamp, very early production
16" "Super" Stambul format stamp
15" plain stamp hi hats
2 Super formula Stambul stamp on the left, plain stamp upper right, preserial formula 602 lower right
two "Super" only Stambul format cymbals, notice the difference in bell shape
.jpg)
Information from: Paiste '57-'59 catalog, Steve Black, Todd Little, Dan Garza, Fritz Steger
Return to the Paiste Series Portal
Return to the Paiste Cymbal Type Portal
